Stephen Pollard • Polly Toynbee's distortion

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June	20
2006

Polly Toynbee's distortion

» Posted on June 20, 2006 11:16 AM » Category: Buffoons

I was intrigued by the end of Polly Toynbee's column today, in which she mentions this site - specifically, some comments left here by one Janan Ganesh.

Here's what she writes:

Many thanks to the reader who found other Janan Ganesh works. Here is a sample of his compassion in a comment on Darfur that he wrote on the website of Stephen Pollard, the rightwing commentator who brands his site "Never knowingly understated".

"Let the Sudanese die - it's none of our business.

"It isn't any of our business. Iraq is a strategically vital country, which is why the project to remove Saddam and install a civilised form of government is so justified and important. Sudan is not. These half-baked interventions to temporarily stabilise failed states are functions of Blair's ridiculous 'Let's save the world and love each other, guys' approach to foreign policy. How many is it now? Kosovo, Sierra Leone, we're still in Bosnia - pointless interventions in pointless places.

"Blair is doing this while simultaneously shrinking the forces. When Bush extends America's military commitments, he ensures that concomitant extra resources are provided (more than concomitant, in fact - defence spending is already up 35% under Bush). Labour politicians just see defence as another cash cow to milk so that more money can be blown on nursery schools for inner-city orphans or whatever. This government makes me want to vomit sometimes."

I thought I should have a look to check what Mr Ganesh had written on my site. And it turns out that most of what she has quoted is indeed posted by him.

But not the words ""Let the Sudanese die - it's none of our business" - which are clearly the most incendiary and vile words. The rest are an expression of mainstream traditional realpolitik Conservative policy. The sentence "Let the Sudanese die - it's none of our business" is the headline on my post, which is clearly a headline and clearly meant as a my take on the views of opponents of intervention.

Either Ms Toynbee saw it was a headline and nonetheless deliberately attributed them to Ganesh (of whom I have never heard until now, and with whom I disageee) which is shocking if true. Or she is utterly cavalier about such things. Or she is too stupid to realise the difference between a headline on a post and a comment posted by a visitor to a site.

I certainly don't think she is stupid.

(And yes, I realise that her point is that the Conservatives haven't really changed, and that Ganesh's views show that. But attributing words to him which he didn't write doesn't show that. It shows a lot more about Ms Toynbee.)

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Comments

i'd say it was bad journalism but it's not .
it's an attempt to smear your site by linking to an extreme
comment (in this case one that was never utterd) but in pollys
world the truth is not a consideration when dealing with people
who have opposing viewspoints.to her it's simple (job done)

Stated by: s.h on June 20, 2006 11:56 AM

Maybe you should update your blogroll to include the excellent "Factchecking Pollyanna", http://factcheckingpollyanna.blogspot.com/ which deals with many of the idiot's half baked assertions.

Stated by: Ross on June 20, 2006 1:27 PM

In any event, isn't her complaint about this issue rather hypocritical in the light of the Guardian's own relatively low profile as compared for example with the acres of space that newspaper regularly devotes to demonising Israel?

And where has the Guardian been as the Nazi-like occupation of Tibet has continued and the Russians have raped Chechenya?

There is little I find more sickening than the selective outrage of the journalists at that newspaper.

Stated by: Joshua on June 20, 2006 2:53 PM

"but in pollys world the truth is not a consideration when dealing with people who have opposing viewspoints"

It that is so, I wonder if it is a familial trait?

"A moribund civilisation"- Arnold Toynbee on Jews

"The Jewish treatment of the Arabs in 1947 was as morally indefensible as the slaughter by the Nazis of 6 million Jews" - Arnold Toynbee

Stated by: Joshua on June 20, 2006 3:08 PM

Joshua

The only issue that the left has been consistent on has been the demonising the Jews, the Yanks and the Brits. The whole point is to make evey action, and in Israel's case its existence, illegitimate. We know they don't actually give a monkey's about the things they claim to be concerned about - as you say, look at Tibet. The thing is, if you look at Tibet you see the communist Chinese.

Interesting that Toynbee berates Ganesh for his apparent lack of compassion in saying we should stay out of Darfur. The pro-terrorist left, for whom being dubbed 'compassionate' is the highest level of existence, have been demanding we capitulate to barbarism and leave Iraq since the moment we went in. You can accuse the left of being many things, but being consistent isn't one of them.

Stated by: Pete_London on June 20, 2006 3:16 PM

"The only issue that the left has been consistent on has been the demonising the Jews"

I wholeheartedly agree. Their particular hatred for the U.S. stems mostly I believe from that nation's support for Israel.

In large part, they have simply intellectualised the politically incorrect anti-Semitism of their parents and now engage on attacks against the collective Jew, the Jewish state, instead. Of course, in private they don't much like individual Jews either.

Almost seventy years and millions of murdered Jews later, Jabotinsky is still correct: Europe is beyond salvation. Nowhere is this more true than in Britain, a nation which betrayed European Jewry before, during and after the Holocaust, and is today in the vanguard of those who seek to deligitimise Israel.

Stated by: Joshua on June 20, 2006 3:55 PM

Joshua, please don't tar all of us with the same brush. Britain's culpability during the Holocaust (or otherwise) is a separate issue from the hatred the left feels today towards Israel. I'd apologise for the British left's anti-Israeli tunnel vision if I was any part of that movement, but I'm not.

There are many of us who regard ourselves as friends of Israel, even if we don't agree with some of its government's policies. Don't write us all off.

Stated by: Mr Eugenides on June 20, 2006 4:37 PM

There are many of us who regard ourselves as friends of Israel, even if we don't agree with some of its government's policies. Don't write us all off.

Stated by: Mr Eugenides on June 20, 2006 4:38 PM

Is there an echo?

Stated by: Mr Eugenides on June 20, 2006 4:39 PM

How much did Ms Toynbee write about Darfur or, for that matter, the other civil war in Sudan (in the south) before the former became a trendy subject?

Stated by: Helen on June 20, 2006 5:30 PM

The bit that interests meis this:

Quotation of coyprighted work isfine, as long as it is extracts. How much is an extract depends upon how long the piece is. She’s just quoted the whole thing. That would, I assume, mean that one of the two of you should be submitting an invoice to The Guardian.

Stated by: Tim Worstall on June 21, 2006 10:24 AM

Their particular hatred for the U.S. stems mostly I believe from that nation's support for Israel.

That is but one reason. In the main, I think it is their rage that the USA has proved beyond reasonable doubt that capitalism is a good system. That is why they are out to exaggerate every problem in the US they can find.

On Israel, they have many reasons, but the biggest is Israel's refusal to lie down and take a beating. Defending yourself is the biggest crime of all in hteir eyes. Its so judgmental and it doesn't explore the core reasons for your enemies rage.

Stated by: Serf on June 21, 2006 12:15 PM

Stephen-- Are you saying that British troops should be making humanitarian interventions everywhere in the world, all the time, and that the defence budget should be upped to enable that? If not, in what important respect-- apart from trumpeting your superior theoretical 'compassion'-- do you differ from Mr Ganesh? Just in wanting a few more such interventions and a bit more spending?

Stated by: Matt O'Halloran on June 21, 2006 7:20 PM

I do find the Guardian's attitude to the blogosphere extremely perplexing. You would think it would welcome such an extension of free speech and political engagement, but the likes of Polly Toynbee and Catherine Bennett seem positively bilious in their attitude to it.

When are going to read an opinion piece in the Guardian which praises bloggers for bringing a fresh perspective on a current debate or widening the diversity of opinion in relation to an issue, instead of castigating them for daring to voice opinions contrary to their own?

Stated by: Paul Linford on June 22, 2006 9:28 AM

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