| September | 02 |
| 2004 |

Via Protest Warrior, here's a poster to print off and hand to your appeasenik friends.

MessageSpace
I like that a lot.
Well, let's see... there are more slaves now than at any time in history, communism is still around (about half the human population are governed by communists), fascism is far from dead-so that leaves Nazism. Not much of a force in the world any more I admit (rather like the Tory party, but with more supporters).
And no mention of terrorism, which is what the war in Iraq is supposed to be bringing to an end - making the world a safer place. Been watching the news lately anyone?
Still, the posters add a bit of colour to the site which, in the absence of any intelligent blogging over the last few days, is a consolation I suppose.
"there are more slaves now than at any time in history"
Er no there are not.
"communism is still around (about half the human population are governed by communists),"
Communists do not govern half the worlds population.
Er, yes there are!!! Er no there aren't ! Are too!! Are not!!
Oh, the joys of intelligent debate, eh Ross?
Shall we continue in this vein? Lets not.
"Today, 27 million people are enslaved, more than at the height of the transatlantic slave trade... Slaves are cheap these days. Their price is the lowest it's been in about 4,000 years. And right now the world has a glut of human slaves - 27 million by conservative estimates and more than at any time in human history."
www.csmonitor.com/2004/0901/p16s01-wogi.html
OK I admit it! I was wrong about communism. There are ONLY 1.9 BILLION people in the world living under communism. ( Hardly *dead* though eh, Ross?) A few more wars should sort it all out though, don't you think? Dulce et decorum est, old boy.
Care to respond to my other points old bean?
Mike,
You're not nearly as clever as you think you are. China is now only ostensibly communist, the economic reforms begun in 1978 have developed into a full-blown obsession with ...profit.
By pointing out still surviving outposts of communism and slavery all you have achieved is to highlight that war does work and that we may need to fall back on it again in the future. Indeed, you admit this yourself:
"A few more wars should sort it all out though, don't you think?"
Yes, it's worth a try.
1) If communism is coming to an end in China then it's certainly not due to war. (or did WW3 happen when I was asleep?)
2) The rest of communism ie. the Soviet block may have been ended in part due to something called a 'war' but there wasn't much fighting.
3)North Korea managed to survive the Korean war intact.
27 million slaves and communist China are OUTPOSTS!
If that's your definition of an outpost maybe YOU are not quite as bright as you think you are. And by pointing these out I'm 'highlighting that war does work' Come again? Sorry, I'm not clever enough to work that one out.
By the way my comment on a few more wars was meant to be sarcastic. Didn't you get that. Is that the price to pay for being verrryyy clevvvveeer?
Alex is spot on, of course. But, like me, he missed WW3. (See Norman Poshoretz : ‘World War IV: How It Started, What It Means, and Why We Have to Win)
Alex, we didn't just miss WW3, we missed the start of WW4 as well. We just can't keep up can we? ( Not clever enough?)
Acccording to Posh it was 'The Cold War'! And there was I thinking the cold war was the period we went through crapping ourselves at the thought of....erm... WW3 ! Remember the Cuban missile crisis anyone? Now that was a missed war opportunity, eh Custos? WARNING: SARCASM ALERT! ...
Mike, with your quote re 27 million slaves, you conveniently "forgot" to mention some important points mentioned in that same souce:
"Yet despite this new largely unacknowledged slavery epidemic, Dr. Bales [president of "Free the Slaves"] is optimistic. While the real number of slaves is the largest there has ever been, he says, it is also probably the smallest proportion of the world population ever in slavery. Today, he adds, we don't have to win the legal battle; there's a law against it in every country. We don't have to win the economic argument; no economy is dependent on slavery (unlike in the 19th century, when whole industries could have collapsed). And we don't have to win the moral argument; no one is trying to justify it any more."
So, is the glass half full or half empty?
That's not a question which needs answering Aron. According to the poster it doesn't exist any more.
It certainly matters to me that both fascism and communism have been driven out of my homeland of Germany, and not by peaceful means. Besides, if such evils endure in other parts of the world, the reason is quite plain: not enough war. We did not drop the Big One on Bejing or even invade Cuba, right? Probably because of smartasses like mike and alex here.
It is not a case of being "smartasses", werner. It is fantastic that Germany now lives in freedom, and does not suffer under Nazism or Communism. To claim, however, that it is war (as conventionally defined) which ended Communism in the East and united Germany is simply wrong - it may be trite but ultimately it had far more to do with the human nature and its own internal contradictions (and, yes, Western resolve and resistance to appeasement) than the use of bombs and planes. And a bloody good thing to - because if it had required a war then there probably wouldn't be a Germany around today.
But hey the poster was partly in jest and should be taken in that spirit,if taken merely as a response to those who would say that War NEVER solves anything. The mantra of "war as a last resort" (anything but war) is one which, when dealing with vile and evil men, is one which has arguably caused more harm than good in the twentieth century.
What a roller coaster! I've gone from being 'not as clever as I think I am' (from someone who seems to have the ability to know what I think about my own intelligence) to somehow preventing the nuclear bombing of Beijing and Cuba, (well, I had some help from Alex). I'd love to carry on this thread but I can hardly type straight for laughing. One last point though. Aron Landy, I didn't 'conveniently forget anything'. I made a point. More slaves than ever before. That still stands. The rest is irrelevant to the points raised by the poster. You would save yourselves so much time and effort if you just (all together now) READ THE BLOOMIN' COMMENTS PROPERLY! P.S. Thanks for your efforts Alex, I've been away from the computer, working.
PPS: Just when you think it's safe to go back in the water Custos
gets linked to by Glenn (hey!, indeed!) Reynolds. aka Instabore. Jeez! Is there no justice? ( NO!! PLeeeease don't answer that).
Mike, do you find that you get punched out in bars more frequently than you'd like?
Be serious; or at least be amusing.
Which category do you fall into Sean?
And, for your information, nobody has ever landed a punch on me, You see, I'm a big, south London guy! But at least I can get served in a bar. Buy me a drink one night and let's see if we can cause a riot. Or would that spoil your violent fantasies about me ?
But anyway, your POINT is what, exactly?
Nice web address, by the way. Couldn't you even come up with a vaguely realistic one? http//177027 !!
What's with the anonymity anyway? You guys eh? The world of secret commenting. Oooh Ahhh! Invisible ink and all that, very 4th form, no?
So serious, yet so funny. (On reflection, make that 'risible')
Just reflecting - couldn't it be said that in virtually every incidence of communism taking over a country, it has happened as a direct result of war? Unsurprising, really, since Communists speak the language of the poor and dispossessed - who tend to be at the most plentiful at the conclusion of wars. Even Nazism probably only needed combatting because of a certain war which had occurred before. So war may be the solution, but often it is also the question.
Alex - indeed, war creates excellent opportunities for fascists and religious fanatics. Which is why fighting lots of wars is the best way to ensure peace and democracy.
The poster obviously expresses an American perspective. The "slavery" is pre-civil war american slavery. In that case war was unfortunately the only option available. From said American perspective the rest is self-explanitory
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